The Player Experience
We have been reviewing the feedback from the community in regards to how the feeling and speed of play has been changed with the recent experience changes. With the recent feedback regarding the changes, we quickly understood a different approach was needed. So we viewed the player experience in terms of time and feeling of accomplishment and whether it felt rewarding or not as many of you gave a strong opinion on the matter. Whether it felt worthwhile or not was a reoccurring source of opinion.
In regards to the experience changes, the initial update was an admitted “oops” on our part as we now look back and see that there were several things we did to counter situations that yielded too much experience, which after those aspects were addressed, the added global experience reduction was caused a much harsher reduction than intended. Now having some mechanics to prevent the situations which were causing the high rates, we took a review of the experience yields in a new light, taking the new monster difficulty in to play as well as the removal of the bad situations. Experience is going to end up being increased above what the rates were before the initial update was put in place. Because monsters take a little longer to kill, the experience rate per minute, hour, overall was reduced. So to help give back that lost time and put down a bit of the feeling of extreme grinding, the new rates we are looking to implement will be in fact, greater than before per kill. But with the change of monster difficulty, should bring it close to the feeling of speed than before.
Now even with this, we did want to speed up some of the introduction to game play as well both by monster experience and questing. We are able to immediately affect monster experience, so that is being implemented in the near future. The introduction to ROSE is going to be overhauled and designed so that a new player can quickly be introduced to many of the fun features ROSE has to offer and get them in to the more interesting aspects of game play sooner.
For the high level, near end game content players, we also have plans on making new repeatable content that you can enjoy while we continue to create expanding content in the future as well. All this will take time to create, though we work as quickly as we can to complete it we hope to also bring out smaller updates on the way to help create interesting content for all.
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| 1 ~ 50 rate of leveling | 1~220 rate of leveling |
Bonus Stats
We have heard and understand many complaints in regards to the recent changes to bonus stats. Something we wish to explain further is why we targeted bonus stats, what the intention, considerations and design was and the end goal.
First, why we targeted bonus stats, is because the community has been long asking for game balance and we have witnessed many complaints and situations within game play that have undesired results. This was generally accomplished by stacking a single type of bonus stat. Because of how much was being given through bonus stats depending on some situations or conditions of level range, some players were significantly stronger, to the point of surpassing higher levels monsters or players.
We like the idea of players being able to gain strength, but how much was something that we as a development team didn’t actually know. Because we have taken over development from a previous team, there are still aspects of design to ROSE that we are discovering no longer apply to our current style and mechanics to game play. There have also been standards that we have established internally in regards to game play so when we create new content, we have guidelines to follow so that the content feels more consistent remains enjoyable. The idea of bonus stats we have is that they strengthen a character to an extent. Because many of these values are static, they increase as higher level ranges are reached so that the benefit continues to remain on the same scale of strength increase. However we also saw that certain types of bonus stats were completely undesired. One reason we found behind why, were they did not give the same impact that other stat types gave. For example, 100 HP does not have the same impact as 10 accuracy. Depending on level, it became even more of an issue. So what we did was create a means to see the rate each type of stat would naturally generate from a player as they leveled. The basis of this was that if 1 point of STR, generated X amount of HP, 1 point of CON generates X amount of accuracy and thus at minimal, these values would be of equal value. We understand that even with this, some stats are more valued because of the style of game play than others.
At this point, it becomes your decision, the player, what style of game play to choose, the build of a character you create and enjoy, as well as the skills and passives that enhance those bonuses further. That 100 HP for a Soldier gives more because of passives that boost HP. However, for a class like a Muse or Dealer, who aren’t primarily strength focused, that 100 HP could mean more than they would get naturally. To us, this was a manner of whether a player would decide to focus on stats that their class is strong with and designed for, or to cover for some weaknesses the class may have.
If we only gave stats that offered a faster way to kill, there would be a loss to strategy of game play when faced with unique builds. What we want is for there to be more than a single build, so there can be a little more diversity between classes and builds. The intended effect is that because the bonus stats are closely matching in how they are generated, that class passives and builds would further separate the value of those stats depending on class and build. We understand that there are still issues of balance needed to be addressed between classes, but we believe that those issues are now located between passives. We do have it in mind to conduct an overview of class balance, because even now we hear complaints regarding certain classes being overpowered, un-killable or dominant above all.
Item Drops
Firstly, we would like to acknowledge the strong feedback of complaint over “low level” items, dropping in “high level” areas. This was an intention of the new drop design that items that dropped were more relevant to the area and level range associated to.
Not to ignore the issue of grey and such powders dropping in Orlo, that was not intended and will be addressed as quickly as possible along with any other drops that may be found to be incorrectly associated. But to expand on this topic, some items are not associated to level, in fact some items are level-less. Catalysts have no level association to them. They are useful to all ranges of players because of their effect towards success with refining.
Chemicals were given a similar treatment so that new and beginning players would have the ability to become part of the economy with the aspect of high level players purchasing common chemicals for the low tier, easier gems.
To go further behind the new design intentions, we have made some very distinguishing factors in regards to the types of drops.
Common drops are based on the area, which contain items like the HP & MP boosters, basic crafting materials, a couple of the lowest quality chemicals and a couple items that could be used for selling to NPCs for a zulie. This tier of drop is always going to be based on the map that you’re on. Simple basic monsters are going to have a high rate of yielding items from this category, as they are the most abundant in-game. These types of monsters would be used to farm for crafting materials most commonly. The higher tiers of drop categories are based on the monster itself and from these categories the items will always be consistent from that monster, if an item drop rolls from this list.
Uncommon drops, being based on the monster are less frequent than the common group, especially the basic simple monster types. As a monster becomes more difficult, such as a leader, the uncommon group becomes more frequently accessed and the common group less. Captains and higher don’t access the common group, but have much higher rates are the uncommon and even rare and ultra rare. Uncommon drops consist of typically basic equipment for a class, the simple jewelry, slightly better chemicals than would be found in the common group, Mythril Drill, standard refine materials (bindrunes, talismans, apotropes).
Rare drops begin with Leader types, which contain basic weapons, blue armors, Orihalcon Drill, better catalysts and chemicals, rare refines (Ancient Scarab, Protective Amulet, Mystic Charm) .
Ultra Rare drops begin with Captains and consist of things like blue weapons, Adamantium Drill and higher quality catalysts and chemicals.
Epic drops are limited to only kings and bosses, but at a low rate. Items within this category consist of items like the latest epic weapons and other such armors and equipment as they are created, the Aurum Drill, the highest quality catalysts and chemicals and items along the level of high desire and impact to game play.
It is a lot to take in, but what we were aiming for was a simple system when experienced within game play and altering the expectation that when you fight a harder monster, you have a chances at better drops. And how we are setting up monsters is in a similar manner, where their natural difference in strengths is what sets their drop rates.
The basic types such as Guard, Fighter, Warrior, Ranger, Hunter, Magician would have a high rate of common, low rate of uncommon.
The leader types would have a low rate of common, high rate of uncommon and a low chance of rare.
Captain types would have a high rate of uncommon, low-mid chance of rare and low chance of ultra rare.
Sub-Boss types would have a mild rate of uncommon, mid-low chance of rare and low-mid chance of ultra rare.
Boss / Kings would give you your best chance at rare, ultra rare and begins the low chance of epic above all the other types of monsters.
On top of all this, the leader, captain, sub-boss and kings have been also given styles, which we hope to further help players identify with in-game when hunting for certain types of equipment. When you want to hunt for specific equipment, you’ll want to hunt certain types of monsters
The monster type will affect the type of class equipment that will drop from them. This is encompassing to all monsters:
| Guard types drop equipment for : | Soldier / Muse |
| Fighter types drop equipment for : | Soldier / Hawker |
| Warrior types drop equipment for : | Soldier / Dealer |
| Ranger types drop equipment for : | Hawker / Dealer |
| Hunter types drop equipment for : | Hawker / Muse |
| Magician types drop equipment for : | Muse / Dealer |
Leaders, 
Captains, 
Sub-Bosses and 
Bosses all have these basic types associated to them, which was said earlier is planned to be updated in-game so that players can see their basic associated types, in addition to their Leader, Captain, Sub-Boss and Boss status.
The experience updates will happen all at once across all areas and levels, but the drop updates will continue at weekly intervals starting at the highest leveled areas and migrating down to encompass all areas of ROSE. We are expecting to be done with the drop updates by early April if all goes smoothly.
I meant thursday, not tuesday, sorry.
Test Server Pegasus
Well firstly I have already said i like the update that you first brought out but it obviously could of done with a few tweaks here and there. Opening up the Test server would of been a better idea for people to be able to test major updates before they go live. I and many other have stressed this many times in the past but it doesn’t seem to happen.
The benefits of opening the test server for major updates is that we can test the update for a week or two and give our feedback for you too make any adjustments needed. This also will save you time in the long run as well since there won’t be an uproar of people complaining about the update which then saves you time because you don’t have to keep doing emergancy maintenances and consentrating on trying to resolve what has happened, Which then leaves you time to do other things like new content and fixing bugs that already exsist in the game.
Drops
The drops on Orlo are still quite bad, I understand what you are trying to do to the drop system and I agree with it, it has needed a revamp for awhile. However this has not exactly gone to your plan by judging the current drops rate on orlo and the monsters drops.
What ever you did with the new update for VER.330 has changed the drops, but obviously not the grey powder as you say you are removing the bad drops from the drop table which shouldn’t be there but for some reason now, the mobs are dropping far too many yellow equips. We farm for a reason, that reason is to obtain Materials and blue items. We do not farm for yellow items and yellow weapons when you can simply buy them from a NPC cheap enough. If yellow armour and weapons was removed from the NPC’s then i would agree strongley that they need to be in the drop table. But i honestly don’t see the point of them being there. You can bearly sell them for anything to an NPC. There’s no point putting them into a vend as crafters will simply use there discount skill and buy from the NPC which isn’t at all exspensive.
There are lots of ways to resolve this:
-Remove from the drop table or lower the rate of them extremely low.
-Remove them from the NPC’s and decrease there rate a little lower then they are now.
-Keep in the drop table and change the price of which the NPC sells them for, ie alot higher then what they cost atm as otherwise if the price isn’t changed then it remains useless as it is at the moment.
The change to the rarity of the drops is a good idea but it isn’t going to work if most of the monsters on Orlo are mostly Basic type monsters. There is the odd monster group that spawns leaders all the time like mastryx but you don’t see any captains or sub-bosses. The terrasaurous monsters isn’t a bad spawn, it spawns everything apart from a Sub-boss. Then there are other spots where you won’t get nothing but basic type monsters. There are lack of Leaders, Captains and Sub-bosses on orlo and where there are few they don’t spawn enough. How do you expect us to get the better drops if we can’t fight the right monsters to get them?
One of the main problems i have on Orlo is that i don’t think I have ever seen a Sub-Boss monster on Orlo. Sub-Boss monster to me represents that it is getting close for the Boss to spawn so the Sub-boss comes to battle first. For example in a fighting situation if i was fighting the GMD, to make it spawn I would expect, first you kill the Basic type monsters, like mini devourer and devourers, once you have killed a few waves of them the next tier of monsters would spawn and it would be something like Basic monsters and Leaders, once a wave of them it would be Leaders and Captains, Then after them it would be Captains and a Sub-Boss, and then finally Captains and the boss.
The difficulty should be increased when trying to draw out the boss. Not random spawns and then the boss magically appears. The longer you kill to draw the boss out the better the drops should increase. Once the boss spawns you start all over again, so few waves or basics and so on.
Obviously it shouldn’t be like this in all spawns as all spawns don’t have a boss monster. but this is an example but it should be a little alike. So maybe a few spawns without the bosses should just spawn up to the Sub-Boss and other spawns should just spawn up to the Captain types.
There need to be some kind of consistancy rather then everything been all random and all over the place. If it was done this way there would be more to aim for as you have to battle through the stronger monsters to get to the boss. So the longer you fight at a spawn the more difficult is gets but the better the drops become.
What I also disagree on is the drop rarity graphs you did. Basing my opinion on the Common – Epic drops the rarity should be a little different, you don’t through all that to kill the king to get a yellow weapon.
My opinion on how it should is this:
[IMG]http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k254/mattyshell/cccccccc.png[/IMG]
By this you know when killing a king you are going to get some kind of decent drop without a yellow weapon droping and ruining your mood to even bother killing a king. The thing the stop me from killing them at the moment is the fact that hardly anything drops and when it does its a yellow or a blue piece of armour which isn’t that great.
By changing it to this is give more motivation to kill these cetain types of monsters. The only one i agree on is Common monsters and leaders as there the more frequant monsters in the game anyway. High type of monster you go to your not getting enough benefits so what is the point.
EXP
Well I’m not going to say much regarding this. I think its stupid the way you have made it even eaiser then before the patch. Yes it was pretty bad on hwo much it changed with VER.328 but now its too much. I think it needs decreasing a little, not alot.. for godsake not a lot but I think its far to high now, especially if you plan to add more quests into the game to help grinding feel less boring. Just my opinion as i know people love teh new higher EXP. (Just a side note, no I do not have max characters so I am not saying it because I have already gotten to 220).
Substats
Well I agree it needed changing to make other stats more useful but you have kill crafters. Nothing really now compares to Union war gears at all. We artisans have already been struggling to sell the best stats pre-VER328. You need to revamp the craft stats again. We need to be able to Craft stats that are worth while to compete close enough to union gear and clan war gear when it finally comes out. Make it extremely hard to craft if you really want too and i made hard by for example 1000 crafts and you get an epic stat. something that will help Artisans make money and be able to actually make a business out of there skills like there suppose too. Because at the moment the 40/10 stat will now sell for 10m on a peice of level 200 armour. Materials cost far more these days to even make any kind of profit. Something needs to be done to revamp artisans as they are never thought of in update and always get crushed the worse by them and Im sure many crafts especially Jagz will agree. Its getting tiresome.
I think for the bonus, the “Value” of the Item should not be lost after nerfing. GOD KNOWS how long players took to get the desired stat of 10/40s. This bonus stat has lost its value after making the nerf on AP40 and 30/30s more valueable. Please consider the “before value” of the piece when u nerf. Please make the nerf on the 10/40 still more valueable than the rest.
Another thing that needs to be reviewed.
I am playing with my champ in Ruins where i try to get an epic weapon.
Do you have a change to get one in Ruins too?
Because i have the feeling it drops in Orlo only.
The drops are still poor, after several hours i got arounf 80 low essense and a few grey powders.
Nothing to get excited about.
I also tried with my mage to farm there and i felt that mage is so much weaker when it comes to defense.
I take significant hits from mobs, even with 8k defense.
My champ however does have a scratch.
Compared to a champ aoe the mage aoe is weak.
If you want to balance review mage abilities too.
First if all it needs to be said:
You NEVER should have done all of these updates at once. You in one shot unsettled everyone.
You have done irreparable damage to the game is that will NEVER be undone. There are many people who have left and will never again play NA Rose. That is the honest to god truth.
Now: Experience, not surprising you had to return it to what it was…you cannot give children candy and then take it away. Making it harder to kill monsters should have been the fix there from day one.
As for drops…I really don’t understand how the drop rate of high level refines on orlo has to do with the drop rate of high level refines on junon. The reason why high level refines weren’t there before was because lower level refines don’t need to be refined to 15 so you can live or level. Having lower level chars making more money is a great idea however you have now extremely adversely affected the ability of high level characters to make money except for a very few places. If I wasn’t already rich I would quit the game, you give better drops to the people who really don’t need them(making them have more money is nice but…) and taking most of the drops away from people who not only need them to refine but need them to keep playing the game.
It costs WAY more to level/upkeep/refine a high level character than it does a lower level one. High level characters need more money and you’ve made it very hard to do now. Trying buying that billion zuly armor with blue powders. Try buying the mats to make that billion zuly armor with blue powders.
I’ve done some sample hunting with your new drop rate and I can tell you that it’s utter crap. It’s pointless to hunt on orlo still….utterly pointless. Are we supposed to farm for 3 months just to try to refine 1 piece of armor to 15 and hope to god we get no fails? The drop rate is COMPLETELY unrealistic and you have seen the players answer about how they like it by the fact that the game is still bleeding players off like it’s gunshot. You have HUNDREDS of lvl 200-220 characters…where are they supposed to hunt…seriously, where are they supposed to hunt? I can see you making muris gate better so what…the clans with 15 active players own and the clans with just a couple people spend their lives flat or farming useless trash on the other side of muris. Seriously…take a good look at things…you continue the old programmers horrible work of making wretched choke points where a few can farm and the rest can just go to hell for drops.
I for one do not feel that you have an idea about what it’s like to be a character in the game of rose. You make widespread changes that would have been nixed/slowly integrated by 99% of the community. Someone there needs to play an unhelped game from level 1. Get to certain places in the game where it doesn’t matter how good you are, some other type of char beats you no matter how good yours is. Get to a place like Muris Gate and be unable to hunt there due to huge clans owning it.
I for one will quit the game, cold if you cannot provide a game that rewards me for my hard work, Muris Gate can be owned by like 5 people, leaves the rest of us doing what….
I just hit over 30 monsters at muris gate and got 1 powder and 1 ether. Those drops are unacceptable. If you think your level 200 players are going to play your game and buy from your item mall when they get crap like that, you’re seriously deluded. BTW: golden armors? just take them out of the drop table pls, all they will ever do is evaporate like most of the other drops you provoide us.
The conclusion….if you do not fix the drops on orlo, most of us are going to quit and we will not come back. We need gold pots at the end of rainbows…the current drop table is completely inadequate. The fact that you took time to nerf the ghosts on orlo but not to fix anything…that makes me absolutely furious. People who WERE playing through this “update” were at least making some zuly off that and you screwed that up too.
Fix it…fix it fast because town sure is looking deserted these days. That or figure out a way for shops to trade with each other and buy item mall items automatically because real world people won;t be.
I just saw information about the 3/11 update. Bye “fixing” the drops on orlo, did you mean the part where you nerfed the ghosts so they didn’t drop 3rd grade gems anymore? I’m not seeing a thing about where the drops are “fixed” on orlo…there are no lisents dropping, the monsters are dropping pink powders, the odd useless grade 1 gem(for the most part 1st grade gems aren’t refined anymore due to the cost of chem..2 1st grade gems+8chem=more than 1 2nd grade gem sells for…just so you know…those 1st grade gems are worthless except for d1, po1, sa1) The point? Please don’t even put most of 1st grade gems into any drop table in the game because they are pretty much npc.
Honestly you need to understand something very important. Level 220 characters are doing nothing. There is nothing to do other than sit and earn money farming lisents, drops that are meaningful. If you do not offer a reasonable amount of meaningful drops then there is no point for any of us to play your game. I’m talking about a couple lisents of some sort per 30 monsters or so. If you cannot offer up an incentive to play, just fold the game now as you will not be seeing any of us play.
Given the few number of people playing at lower levels, you need your high level players.
Put yourselves in our shoes…would YOU sit there earning no xp, gaining no levels for ancient coins and pink powders? Put yourselves in our shoes, would you pay money on a game that won’t give us rewards for playing?
LadyPsyber is absolut right.
nothing more to say…
First of all i have to say that i totaly agree to LadyPsyber.
The update is in the drop change really bad. How shall it be possible to obtain money with that drop rates?
You cant do that to us. Me im a level 220 scout. It was hard for me to farm before the update but now?
The only way how to get zulie any longer is buying IM points and in fact this is what you prefer.
The whole update is only, that you will become more money. I cant farm 3 weeks to get 100 million!!!
PLease fix it and make the droprates in orlo like they were before. I even get more zulie with my level 95 mage!!! How can this be??
I wont buy IM points to anytime if you wont fix it.
Before the update what concernes the droprates in orlo, peoples where happy because you can get moneya for doing work in orlo but now it isnt possible any longer.
Please change it again or I and others will quit ROSE be sure.
perres
The boss in the middle of Junon clan field is absolutely bugged.
1st: Empty drop
2nd: Empty drop
3rd: Orihalcon drill
4th: Empty drop
5th: Empty drop
6th: Lisent Pb (1)
7th: Empty drop
8th: Empty drop
lol.
The attack speed nerf is absolutely ridiculous also.
It’s not like if dodge on hawker class too good then you can go ahead and nerf the offensive ability of a hawker, build difference is what make this system interesting, some ppl want to be high offensive some ppl want to be high defensive, I really don’t get the reason behind this attack speed nerf, my scout lost like 50% attack speed, it makes PvM, PvP combat absolutely hopeless.
If you haven’t seen it, I will say it again, you guys need to keep things consistent, best stats need to stay the best, what’s up with the 10STR 40AP, 6DEX 40ACC become inferior, and those 10HP 50 ACC born? Stop messing around, this is not how you develop games, shuffling best stats, armors, weapons, gem sets.
Finally, about the whole scene about regaining the challenges in this game, just give it up, giving out free candies to children and take them back is not a good idea. People will rage quit, it isn’t the rose before free to play era anymore where we actually have a reason to grind the levels, farming and refinement, right now it’s all about cheating through item mall.
Things left unbalanced for too long, so good luck balancing the champ class without driving everyone away…
open forum or to comment, it seems the game is coming to an end?
I agree fellas its boring even tho i dont have a 220 char please do something, also
its kinda of topic but i made clan cuz i was that bored and i cant change the clan icon, its in the rose folder just not working someone make a vid maybe im doing it wrong or something help thanks
i farmed gates of muris for a little over 1 hour, not a single lisent drop. i kill a monster in 2-4 hits, so i was dropping monsters at a pretty decent rate. all i got was yellow armor, some chems to refine gems, and some coins. this was my first time logging in since late february and i must say im very dissappointed in the way this game is heading.
for starters, i noticed my armor got nerfed. i dont think atk speed was as overpowered as you guys thought. with high atk speed u get pretty low atk power and it ussually isnt worth it to go full atk speed. it looks cool in a fight to have high atk speed but its not very helpful. watever, if u guys REALLLY wanted to change something so bad u can mess that one up, its OKAY. -_-
refine fail drops 2 lvls now? are u serious? it took me months to get my wand to lvl 15. i remmber twice i failed from 13 down to lvl 9 before this update. after spending over a billion ( i suspect closer to 2 billion) zuly trying to max my wand, i seriously doubt ill ever touch the refining system again until u guys undo that change. its not worth the risk for the amount of time u need to put in to farm for these lisents. it was bad already, now its even worse.
i liked before how i could farm for an hour and be able to get anywhere between 10-20 lisents. the drop rate is too low right now. not very rewarding at all.
killed a grand master devourer – no drop. t rex king – no drop. scorpion king – someone else killed, dropped a drill. this doesnt seem rewarding either.
yea… my clan of 46-50 members is pretty much all inactive now thanks to this update. theyve all moved on to other games.
forums still down? comon guys… its been forever. is there even a reason? or are u doing this on purpose? if it was up im sure most of the threads would be rage threads on how bad this update is how many ppl are going to quit because of it.
sorry guys, u really dropped the ball on this one. i enjoyed the game before this update. now its eh. u should really coordinate with the few people who cared enough to give u feedback on this blog to make things right.
i bet if u did a 1 month roll back and pretend that u guys never tried to pull this off a lot of ppl would come back and enjoy this game.
i like the idea of of the epic gear tho, cheers on that.
Darkened and Balanced, not good for nothing.
Aries is absolutely right in the point that you shoule speak with us and learn what update makes sense and what update doesn’t make sense.
By the way. I hearde about a skill with you can debuff peoples. Well good work (irony)
Now clerics are absolutely senseless in UW. And scouts are bad now too. Scouts have 5 self buffs. They absolutely essential to be a balanced to others. Other jobs do just have one. For them this skill is good.
You should change it. maybe that it just debuffs the buff potion effects.
Well another bad idea that destroys Rose.
Delete all this updates and make it good again.
Thats all i hope